Urgent...boycott/watchlist coffeeclickers.com...privacy/spam

[freebiesite]

hi..

this is the sort of thing that this site should watchlist immediately..

a site that is in such clear violation of every rule/law and just plain out of line

coffeeclickers is sending emails..spammails...to a memberbase they purchased

the memberbase is from some of Michellle *the whale jerk...old sites...that were taken over by the not so ethical gal who had cherokee etc..tanya or whatever...

now...she has shut all of her silly failed sites...but sold the memberbase to a new site...coffeeclickers

the wm is clueless....thinking that he is not in violation of spam etc...this is soooo clearly out of line..this is where the admins here should post a warning..have a special warning page...

this is just plain out right wrong...the people who were in penquin etc have been thru the wringer, with michelle, with this tanya etc...now they are being spammed..

Heads UP UP UP

Rob..please...do NOT drop the ball on this one/?

stand for something..or fall for anything JMO

[Rob]

If my watch list proposal gets the OK, then sites like this will be able to be placed on the Watch List.

Rob

[Discordia]

I definitely know it was WhaleIntoMail that sold the member list. I started receiving emails from Coffee Clickers about 2-3 weeks ago, and today I decided to try logging in. I used my user name and password that I used for WhaleIntoMail, and sure enough I was able to log in! The password I used at Whale was unique and I didn't use it at any other PTR, so I know for a fact it was either Michelle or the new owners of Whale that sold the database.

[AnI4AnI]

Who does you proposal need to get the ok from, Rob?

I think anything to improve communication to the general public about bad sites is an improvement....and I also think a more hands-on approach is seriously needed here. Not to get anyone in the hot seat but for reassurance. I think a great deal of people value the opinions of the staff here and would love to hear more from them. I don't know if that conflicts with the process of boycotting or not but as you mentioned before, the objectivity factor may have stifled progress.

Open up! Live on the edge...like I do! LOL

[freebiesite]

Yes..it may be whale and/or penguin...

the coffeeclickers just opened....and it has 10,000 plus members...some think that it may be several of michelles sites databases put together

this is something that really needs to be "listed' ...unlike dead programs like eppipo etc this one could start doing the old deal of selling upgrades,etc...taking in money..

the total lack of ethics is amazing..and i even saw a post where a misguided soul urged others to "help" the "poor" wm of coffee.....what a nice guy to take on all those abandonded members...of course he gave them NO warning, he did NOT take on site debt..it is just..email list..

I honestly think something like this, such a clear violation of privacy policies, deserves some page of its own, catagory of it's own....this site needs to put out a reasoned "presentation" of this shady deal..

ie, listing what a privacy act means...saying why this is wrong....

this is wayyy beyond a hot potato..this is really a NEW low in ptr..

a little while back I had some jerk email me ..probably thru the cash crusader list of sites...(we get a TON of spam, and I may remove myself from the list) he was selling a database from one of the failed large "silly" sites...he offered it to many wm.....

just when one wants to say "how low can you go" this comes along..

I "vote" for Rob and his admins to be able to "do something"..place even a special warning page/link....

Even if you dont I will personally not run an ad for this site...this is just ...wrong....I would prefer a page to "link" to, to explain to a potential advertiser what is wrong with it, but if that does not happen I will turn it down, let them know myself and take my chances....<sigh>

[Rob]

I'm not waiting for the "OK" as such... more a general feeling to emerge. I think it's hard for me to assume a general feeling when my proposal has only been posted for 24 hours, with about 2 replies. However the signs are promising.

Tomorrow I'm away - but over the weekend unless there are serious objections to my proposal I will write up the accompanying explanation text for the new watch list. I will back up the old watch list (for obvious reasons), and then open up all current Watch List programs to the moderating team to make decisions over. In the interests of completeness, this will include all programs with 5 complaints or over.

Once we have established which of these programs should be on the list, they will be transferred. Then - we will look at other programs such as GreenZap, CoffeeClickers, possibly inviting submissions from users to be considered for the Watch List. These type of submissions will be placed with brief explanations - as opposed to the others which would be placed in their current form (due to their having attained 5 or more complaints PLUS staff approval).

Rob

[freebiesite]

Oh wow..just when u think ptr could not get more dirty LOL

I looked up the whois..and it is the guy who "saved' michelles many sites, who then had "server crashs" and backup problems and mysterious data glitches.....the guy, steve allen who promised to honor the debt racked up by michelles sites, who promised to pay the members..

now they are all just lumped into one "supersite"..earnings gone...emailed by this jerk...who is baffled as to why people are angry??

ani..we need some of your spam resources..where can people report spam?

one thing I see this guy has incomplete whois info..I intend to report that to internic...remember what happened to santas LOL>..

Registration Service Provided By: Cash Crusader Hosting
Contact: cashcrusader@gmail.com
Visit: http://www.cashcrusaderhosting.com

Domain name: coffeeclickers.com

Registrant Contact:
Cash Crusader Hosting
Steve Allen (cashcrusader@gmail.com)
+1.1234567890
Fax:
P. O Box 1145
Gaffney, SC 29342
US

[AnI4AnI]

Freebie, basically people can report SPAM to their internet service provider. In this case, I suppose "involuntary" members could also alert the various payment processors he uses. Hope that helps.

[Merlin2307]

Anyone who desire to file a complaint about spam can do so with the Federal Trade Commission @http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/conline/pubs/online/inbox.htm. There is an article there that explains spam, how it origionates,how to attempt to control it and what to do if the opt out links in the email do not work and links for reporting spam.

[AnI4AnI]

Many government organizations are now warning people to NOT use any opt-out links, to NOT click on ANY links in the emails at all...to just report them to their ISPs or to the authorities.

[bellestraker]

Many government organizations are now warning people to NOT use any opt-out links, to NOT click on ANY links in the emails at all...to just report them to their ISPs or to the authorities.



I am not familar with all the rules for spam but seem to recall reading that if they sent only one email and it contained an opt out...that it was not spam.

Is that incorrect??

I hope so

Have a good one

Belle

[freebiesite]

HI Belle...I think that is the OLD rule..the new can spam law that took effect last year does not permit that

the deal is....all of that michelles sites are being spammed by coffeclickers..

and one or two of michelles old sites PLUS the 6 or so sites owned by tanya..who shut them down ..are being spammed by a new site called "scarlettmails" or some such

the fact is that these people did NOT join or signup to coffeeclickers or scarletmails....they joined penguine or whale or cherokee or whatever...big BIG difference..

this is just plain wrong..but it is done...I have had emails from wm offering to sell databases of some site that is closed or closing...some of the 100/10000 sites are starting to do this as they have run their "course" of ripping people off and are not getting the action they were getting when they first came on the scene

anyway you look at it, just totally wrong.....some sense of ethics is needed in ptr JMO

[bellestraker]

I guess I should be keeping a bit more up to date.
So much of the garbage I get I had just deleted rather than bother with it...or thinking that it would not be classed as spam anyway.

Even under the old rule I would assume that its spam to use someone elses data base and send emails ( which sure as hell should be illegal..and thankfully seems to be)



Thanks for the reply

Belle




HI Belle...I think that is the OLD rule..the new can spam law that took effect last year does not permit that

the deal is....all of that michelles sites are being spammed by coffeclickers..

and one or two of michelles old sites PLUS the 6 or so sites owned by tanya..who shut them down ..are being spammed by a new site called "scarlettmails" or some such

the fact is that these people did NOT join or signup to coffeeclickers or scarletmails....they joined penguine or whale or cherokee or whatever...big BIG difference..

this is just plain wrong..but it is done...I have had emails from wm offering to sell databases of some site that is closed or closing...some of the 100/10000 sites are starting to do this as they have run their "course" of ripping people off and are not getting the action they were getting when they first came on the scene

anyway you look at it, just totally wrong.....some sense of ethics is needed in ptr JMO

[Rob]

As promised, I've written the text for the new Watch List.

All current programs with 5 or more complaints are being reconsidered by the staff now, to make sure we have that stage sorted correctly before pursuing the other programs with special "Watch Status" :)

Rob

[Kaneda]

HI Belle...I think that is the OLD rule..the new can spam law that took effect last year does not permit that


Hi there Freebie!

I came across this link, at the ftc. It references the law going into effect on January 1st, 2004 so I'm assuming this is the "new can spam" law:

http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/conline/pubs/buspubs/canspam.htm

Has this paragraph:

It requires that your email give recipients an opt-out method. You must provide a return email address or another Internet-based response mechanism that allows a recipient to ask you not to send future email messages to that email address, and you must honor the requests. You may create a "menu" of choices to allow a recipient to opt out of certain types of messages, but you must include the option to end any commercial messages from the sender.

Any opt-out mechanism you offer must be able to process opt-out requests for at least 30 days after you send your commercial email. When you receive an opt-out request, the law gives you 10 business days to stop sending email to the requestor's email address. You cannot help another entity send email to that address, or have another entity send email on your behalf to that address. Finally, it's illegal for you to sell or transfer the email addresses of people who choose not to receive your email, even in the form of a mailing list, unless you transfer the addresses so another entity can comply with the law.



Is there something more updated somewhere that tells people not to opt out? I've never seen anything like that yet.

P.S - hope all is good with you. :)


Kan

[AnI4AnI]

I don't remember specifically where I read it but I believe it was at the IFCC or FTC sites where they discuss internet fraud, hoaxes, indentity theft, credit card theft, etc. It also may have been from Ad-Aware or MSN...not sure.

It is unwise to click links in an unsolicited email since people are using these "opt-out" mechanisms to trick people now in order to gain access to personal information. It is encouraged to just report the SPAM to your ISP.

[mlev]

I am not 100% sure.

But the optout at bottom of e-mail still valid I think.

On the other hand, companies/agencies involved/concerned with people's protection, would strongly suggest that you do not click a link from a stranger's email.

At the paste those agencies adapt to realities, it may take a few years before something/anything is really done about spammers

[Merlin2307]

Here is a printable copy of the Can-Spam Act of 2004...http://www.spamlaws.com/federal/108s877.shtml from my interpretation of it as long as the email contains a valid subject line and a link or email address for opt-out purposes and the company or person abides by it within 10 days of receipt. There is not a whole lot that can be done. Regarding email list and selling them from what I read as long as the origional company/business or person has nothing in the contract/TOS about not selling,giving away etc of the individuals email or other personal information then it is legal. The act after reading it has alot of big legal loopholes as with the case of coffeeclickers they are in violation in that they used it to sign people up for something without their permission but as long as the emails received offer opt-out options and the individual does not comply with the opt out instructions they can be sent all the email their boxes can hold. Definite government confusion as the FTC and State/Federal attorney generals have control of enforcement.

[Discordia]

Everyone who was signed up at CoffeeClickers, please check if you have also been signed up at www.mega-mails.net as well. Apparently, the database has been sold to more than one web site. I just checked to see if I was signed up at MegaMails and sure enough, I was.

[freebiesite]

This is just soooooo wrong...very sad

scarletmails.com is another one..it is using the database of some of michelles old sites combined with the sorry "gone" sites of tanya..ie, cherokee etc...

this same group of names is being passed around like jellybeans JMO

I feel sorry for the people who were so screwed over by michelle...then passed on to steve allen who apparently is moving them around from site to site...

I really hope this forum will step up to the plate and do something right NOW while this is happening...NOW is when people need to be warned about these schemers and spammers....please rob? admins? mods?? cant you post something on these sites? to me this is so blatantly wrong it is pathetic

[Rob]

The new Watch List should be up tomorrow... including an area for urgent action programs to go on "Watch Status", even without receiving 5 complaints.

Rob

[Discordia]

There is another site that the database was sold to. Please check to see if you've been signed up at www.clickersclub.com like I was and delete your account ASAP.